* Some of them aren’t composing projects, but they’re all projects – i.e. involving some sort of workshop or collaboration!
I’ve delivered lots of composing and other music workshops and projects over the years – some are just one-offs, some are in a short series! Here are some of them – up to the year 2020.

1994 – Woodford House Centenary Project.
This private girls’ school decided to employ three women artists (poet, artist, composer) during the year to make creative visits to the school and inspire the girls, and to celebrate their centenary. I was the composer, and as part of my time there I composed music for them, took composing lessons, directed the choir and orchestra, was shared with local primary schools to produce musical dramas, and gave a composing workshop to local secondary teachers. One of the fruits of that residency was a choral piece, Hodie Christus Natus Est, which was written by me, learnt and performed in one day by the whole school, and has since been performed and recorded by several choirs around the world.

March-April 1995 – Journeys project
I was employed by the Dunedin Sinfonia as one of four composers to work with children from a primary school to compose music about a journey of some sort. My school had a journey through a jungle. All four schools performed at a concert with the orchestra at the end of the project.

October-November 1996 – Onslaught and The Attack Of The Killer Tomatoes
During my time as Mozart Fellow at Otago University, Dunedin in 1996, I undertook several projects in local schools including workshops on Japanese music with ethnomusicologist, Dr. Henry Johnson and composing workshops with children and teachers, but this “composing a musical” project in Port Chalmers was one of the most significant, as it involved not only working with children and teachers from that school, but also primary teaching students from the College of Education, and was started and finished in just over a week in a whirl of creativity.

1998-2001 – SOUNZWrite Resources
I was employed by SOUNZ in Wellington to write nine teaching resources for secondary school teachers about New Zealand music set works for use in their equivalent of GCSE and A level. The set works include three choral works, three orchestral works and three piano works. The last and 10^th resource (Ears Wide Open/Taringa Areare) uses 20 pieces of NZ music and is aimed at helping teachers fulfil the requirements of the new primary school arts curriculum, which was introduced in 2001 and combined music with visual arts, drama and dance, and also emphasised the music of NZ to a large extent.  All 10 resources are used extensively in NZ schools, and the Wellington Sinfonia has run workshops for students and teachers in conjunction with the three orchestral works. One of the featured composers, John Psathas, a lecturer at Victoria University sent this email, “A quick note to say the SOUNZWrite on the aeroplane is fantastic. I had a call from a friend of mine who was raving about it, and said he only wished that same kind of work was done on the old masters! He said it was a wonderful teaching resource and looks forward to more.”
For more information about these resources, have a look at the Centre for New Zealand Music website: www.sounz.org.nz

1999 and 2002 – Wellington Sinfonia study guides
1999: “Blowin’ In The Wind”; “Four Seasons”  I was employed by the orchestra to write study guides for secondary school teachers to accompany workshops the orchestra was giving about Vivaldi’s “Four Seasons”, and a selection of wind music by Stravinsky, Strauss, NZ composer Farquhar, and Varèse. Each guide contains information pages, and a variety of activities which directly address the NZ music curriculum.
2002: “Orchestra’s Story” Similar to the last one but for primary school teachers and students and including a script for the conductor.
Update 2006 – I’ve gathered the Vivaldi activities together and re-written some and they’re all available for you to use on this very website: Vivaldi Four Seasons Project Summary

October-December 2001 – The Messiah
All children in 12 classes from reception to Year 7 and their teachers participated in a production of some of Handel’s Messiah. It was performed in the parish church with art from every class around the walls and windows.. Much of the music was arranged to suit the skills of the children including a small band version of the Hallelujah Chorus. The performance featured dance, slide shows, much singing, instrumental work, projected images, light shows etc and. One audience member, Maureen Nutt, later wrote, “All I can say is WONDERFUL, WONDERFUL. I was really thrilled to be part of it. All your hard work came together beautifully….I think that the sign of something moving is that it stays with you, and this will, for a long time.”

January – March 2002 – Banana Day
All children in a school (St. John Vianney’s Catholic Primary School, Manly, Queensland) of 12 classes participated in drama, dance, art and music around the topic of bananas. Much of the work was created by the children themselves during the term, and the final day included Year 1 telling banana jokes, a banana photography competition, TV adverts for banana products on video, short plays about historic bananas, formation dancing with giant bananas, a musical drama about diseases that affect Queensland banana crops, a banana hat parade, edible banana art, and a good deal of singing of banana songs. It’s amazing how many there are.

November 13th 2003 – Woosha Songs
A group of retired amateur poets gathered together in Gateshead Library to learn about song-cycles through studying and then attending a performance of Schubert’s Winterreise at the Theatre Royal in Newcastle. We then worked together over a few weeks, with poet Gillian Alnutt, to create our own song cycle. The lyrics/poems were written by the group, with help from Gillian, and the music was composed partly by the group members and partly by me. Each song represented a job that they had done in their earlier days, and the concept they settled on for the cycle was of a group in a launderette waiting for their washing, and chatting about “the old days”. We included some washing machine music interspersed with the songs which were performed by a professional singer accompanied by me on the piano. The song cycle was called “Woosha Songs”. The musical confidence of the group increased during the three-month process to such an extent that they performed the Washing Machine music themselves and also sang a round together at the end of the “Woodturning” song.

April-May 2004 – Buildings Project
I was asked by Grangetown Primary School to prepare the opening ceremony for their new school building, and decided to compare the new school to several famous buildings around the world, representing each building in song and with drama, dance or art. I also composed a school song, which would remind the students of the day and its messages, and this has since become an integral part of school celebrations and assemblies. The classes prepared for the performance through study in different curriculum areas. You can read more about this project here!

September-November 2004 – Stravinsky Ballets
All 9 classes in Grangetown Primary school worked towards dance and mime performances of The Rite Of Spring, Petrouchka, and The Firebird during “Stravinsky Week”, which also included the delivery of lessons and programmes of study by the classroom teachers using resources specifically prepared by me. All dance preparation and study of Stravinsky’s life and music prior to Stravinsky Week was prepared and delivered by me.

September-December 2005 – Winter Wear
Grangetown Primary School, Sunderland. All classes in the school worked towards a production based on the geography, history and music of their local river. We incorporated a nativity into the project as well and included sections on Lead-mining in Upper Weardale, shipbuilding in Sunderland, the history of glass-making (including music for a glass orchestra), St. Cuthbert’s Shrine in Durham; the legends of the Pollard Brawn and Lambton Worm; and the Romans in Chester-le-Street. There were elements of singing, instrumental performing, movement, art and composing.
To find out more about this project, click this link.

January – April 2006
Six workshops for 20,000 Voices singing with Early Years classes and collaborating with movement specialist Lynn Campbell. I wrote my song Three Billy Goats Gruff Is A Noisy Story as part of this project!

March 2007 – Source To Sea
Coquet River musical project with Felton First School tracing the journey of the river from Cheviot to Coquet Island using homemade instruments, the school’s new Sound Garden and a new song, Stick River. Here’s a bit of stick river:

April-July 2008
Red Jemma Goes Back project at Alnwick South First School, composing music and enabling students to compose music for an end of year production based on fantasy stories written by the children of the school. Songs included Chocolate River, Roman Head Choppers, Dance With Me Minuet, Wavily Bobbily, Red Jemma, Shiny Mirror, I Will I Will I Will I Will I Will.

March-July 2008 – Near And Far
I worked with teachers in Whalton, Longhorsley and Cambo first schools in Northumberland to facilitate composing based upon the current curriculum-wide themes – “Near and Far” (including hot and cold, China) resulting in compositions by myself and the children using Chinese stories and musical characteristics. Each school performed its own version of a Chinese story in an “opera” style: Mr. Haktak’s Geometric Azure Moonscape; Dijun and the Sun Birds; Lei Kung and the Storm Tree. I also worked with students to create a schools’ anthem based on their ideas about what was important to them about their own school and community and what distinguished it from the other two. The anthem was performed by the entire three schools in for their Olympic day at Gateshead Stadium, each school having their own verse and joining together for the chorus. This project was funded by Creative Partnerships.

June-July 2009 – “Stomp!”
I worked with a dancer at Felton First School to create a musical dance/drama using for inspiration the school-wide (R-4) theme of recycling – Reduce Re-use Recycle. Starting from the premise that there would be home-made instruments and found sounds, song, dance and every child would be involved, we produced a twenty minute production in four one-day sessions based on story ideas from the children, music and interpretive movement created by them and us, and much use of recycled things to produce a very evocative urban soundworld. This followed an earlier project in which the school investigated their local river and the children and I created a musical river of dance, poetry, music and song in their outdoor performance space using “water music” instruments and sounds, as well as classroom instruments and recycled instruments.

June 2009 – Hotspur Festival Songs
It’s a collection of five songs commissioned for the 900^th Anniversary celebrations in Alnwick of the Percy family’s residence in the town. I spoke to local residents and researched broadly to find themes, stories and language which would be appropriate to this very specific location and focus. The performance was to include two local choirs of varying abilities and sizes as well as piano and Northumbrian pipes, about which I previously knew nothing. I worked closely with the Andy the piper, and conductor Peter Brown, to ensure that the music challenged but did not defeat the performers. The finished collection contained five songs interspersed with readings performed by the local amateur dramatic society: Percy, Percy! – an evocation to and partial enactment of battle; Nae Stream Sae Lovely – a gentle ballad of fishing and poaching in the River Coquet, using much Northumbrian dialect; Perilous Land – a trot through the 19^th century Northumbrian countryside with an ironic sideways glance at some of the difficulties one may encounter; The Reluctant Pitman – an evocative and tentative exploration by a visitor to a coal-mine; The Duke Of Northumberland’s Ale – a increasingly drunken drinking song, extolling the virtues of this tasty beverage.

April 2010 – Maori Creation Day
I worked with teachers at Harbottle and Netherton First Schools over a period of three days to learn about some Maori culture and in particular the creation myth. We sang, composed, listened and played instruments. There was a haka, insect music, an earthquake, a bird chant, and a performance of all this and more to parents on the final afternoon – lots of composing, but no photos or recordings!

June 2010 – Medieval Day
I went up to Ford School to deliver a day of Medieval Musical stuff. They were following up this day in school with a visit to Warkworth Castle later in the month, so I filled up the song with Medieval jargon, taught them the song, then we all performed it to assembled parents and friends at the end of the day.

July 10th 2010 – Carnival Of Colours
I was working with teachers and children at Lady Bay Primary School in Nottingham (R-6) to create a carnival extravaganza based around the theme of a rainbow, colours and different cultures. The school had few musical resources so the emphasis was on home-made instruments and found sounds. The final performances consisted of a street parade in samba rhythms followed by year group performances based on a distinctive country and using creative music ideas. The focus classes wrote a “rainbow” story and composed incidental music based on six gifts from the other groups (two short rhythms, a sea shell, a dragon, a Maori pendant, and a banana). They came up with “Bob, the Rainbow-Breathing Dragon”, and their performance rounded off the carnival afternoon.
Penny Brereton, Creative Agent wrote: “The children had all enjoyed the project, they found it challenging and welcomed the opportunity to rise to this. ‘It’s not that we can’t do music, we just don’t do it very often, but we can be good at it.’ They described Cheryl as ‘confident’, ‘funny’, ‘encouraging’, ‘very patient’. They loved what they described as her surprising or eccentric moments. She had clearly made a very positive impression. They had enjoyed her stories and being able to talk to her about their ideas.“
I wrote: “Today was the culmination of an amazing two weeks at Lady Bay Primary School in Nottingham. It was their “Carnival Of Colours” project with multiple colours and countries represented in a parade round the school and along Trent Boulevard at the front, followed by each year group’s performances. This included “Commotion In The Ocean”, Flamenco, Samba, Haka, “Earthquake Chant”, The Sacred Banana Leaf with “Ma-ahoni”, Chinese Dragons and Bob The Rainbow-Breathing Dragon, including the “Pounamu” incantation.”
One of the parents wrote it up in her daily blog that day! http://kazben.blogspot.co.uk/2010/07/09072010-day-12.html

Jan-April 2011 – Holly
I was employed on a Creative Partnerships project to deliver music activities in the Early Years setting at Holly Primary School in Forest Town, Nottinghamshire. The idea was to help the staff there include more music in their delivery of the Early Years Curriculum. I did this with lots of work around phonics, mark-making, graphic scores, stories with music etc etc. I wrote songs for them too. This was actually a 28 day project – four one-week visits.

I was asked one day by one of the other teachers to visit her classroom at some point during the day. They were learning about creatures of the night and asked me if I had any songs. I said I didn’t, but if they told me about what they’d been learning, I would write one for them…so I did and included everything they had been learning about the bats: Creatures Of The Night.

March 2011 – Scary Quiet
Scary Quiet is a song composed for Warkworth C of E First School, Northumberland during a week of moody Easter reflections and activities. It was performed as part of their solemn outdoor Paschal Pageant on the last day of term. You can see a few photos of that event on this video:

April 14th 2012 – Stand Up! Shout Out, Northumberland!
Stand up, Shout out Northumberland!  is the latest of four or five anthem-like compositions I’ve been commissioned to compose for schools or collections thereof. This latest was for the 2012 Northumberland Schools Games, and involved visiting six different school across Northumberland gathering ideas for lyrics, sentiments and musical styles from the youngsters in the schools, and then providing an anthem, the chorus of which was for everyone and the verses of which were for the different regional “teams” to perform. The result is a folk/rap fusion with a proud and confident twist, as requested. You can see and hear the learning video here: Previous anthems include “Our Home Northumberland”, “Our School is like the Taj Mahal” and “St. John Vianney’s School Song”

Update: June 15th 2013
Stand Up, Shout out Northumberland! was given another airing by the children of Whittingham 1^st School as part of their contribution to the Bailiffgate Museum’s Singing Bus Tour.
The children had performed the anthem to Avril Huntly, the coordinator of the “Our Northumbrian Singing Heritage” project during one of her workshops in the school, and she invited them to sing the song again when the bus stopped in Whittingham. Avril commented later, “Yes the children sang the song with great gusto and it was very well received…the musicians and singers on the bus thought it was so lovely, as do I! ….Frankie was there so was able to explain about how the song came to be. We had a fabulous day with great support and lots of happy smiling children, plus the weather was kind to us!”

You can hear a version of this song here!

May 2013 – Snow White
I was asked by a teacher from a school if I would compose some songs for their production of Snow White. I did this – composed three new ones and adapted another with new lyrics. I went there and taught them to the cast one afternoon. I made learning tracks. She asked me to change the songs because they were too hard for the children. They were not too hard – the children could sing them while I was there. My theory was that she was incapable of teaching them herself, and had no money to pay me to go back and reinforce what I’d already done. I was never paid at all for these songs, although I did hear later that they did indeed use two or three of them in the show. Anyway, they’re excellent songs!
A Catalogue Of Unspeakable Fiendishness
Spag Time – This one has been the most popular since this “project” as other schools have used it to bemoan their requirement to do SPaG tests
We’re Coming Home
I Will, I Will, I Will, I Will, I Will – This is the one I adapted from an earlier project, Red Gemma Goes Back.

June 2013 – Something Special
A big project that lasted 18 months in fact, but just one performance. You can read about it here!

August 21st 2013 – Bananas In Dunedin
During my holiday in New Zealand, I rehearsed and performed Banana Fanfare 2 with some delightfully enthusiastic school students from thee Intermediate schools in Dunedin, New Zealand, whilst wielding a banana. Later that same day, I chatty-talked to Otago University composition students about some of my choir pieces, workshops and composing with children and families – I did not have a banana on that occasion!

November 7th 2013 – Musical Enterprise
I responded to a request from Teaching Fellow and entrepreneur Jane Nolan, to talk about my career as a composer, creative practitioner and musical educator to the students on the Musical Enterprise module at the  International Centre for Music Studies at Newcastle University. The main theme of Jane’s follow-up lecture was all about marketing strategies, so Cheryl discussed several of the strategies she herself had tried over the years, as well as playing musical examples from her Youtube channel, seapieparcel http://www.youtube.com/user/seapieparcel  This website was also discussed as well as other forays into the social media world and the successes and draw-backs of that and other strategies. The 60 or so music students were attentive, and one smiled encouragingly! Several aspects of this were fantastic though – Jane’s lecture about marketing was fantastic and gave Cheryl lots of ideas about further marketing strategies and things to consider. Also fabulous and versatile Northeast singer Anna Reay was there promoting her own concert which is coming up at the end of November, and she was a fascinating kindred spirit to meet. Check out her website here:  annareay.co.uk   And finally, it was a sunny, so very sunny day in Newcastle and the Armstrong Building in which this lecture took place, was displayed in all its red, Victorian finery to splendid effect.

March 8th 2014 – Banana Day Blog
Banana Day was actually a project I did in Australia over ten years ago, but fairandfunky asked me to write a guest blog for them after writing my fairandfunky song, so here it is! Banana Day Celebrations! – fairandfunky.com – guest blog

March 18th 2015 – fairandfunky Fairtrade Conference for Schools
I delivered some composing workshops, and you can read all about it here! fairandfunky Fairtrade Conference for Schools 2015

March 19th 2015 – Peering Through The Rood Screen
I was one of four artists employed by Wakefield Cathedral to deliver “Building Together” workshops for Year 3 students from various Wakefield schools. We were each given a particular part of the cathedral to work in and focus on. I was in the quire, beside the organ and on the altar side of the rood screen. I wrote this song beforehand for us all to learn and discuss.

November 23rd 2015 – Huddersfield HCMF
I delivered a workshop at the Huddersfield Contemporary Music Festival in November: “Music at Play – Graphic Scores for Under 5s.” Lots of families took part in an exhausting and exhilarating morning. A fine selection of home-made instruments and found sounds were provided for the participants to use, as well as some gloriously colourful graphic scores for them to organise and interpret into their own music. Feedback included “I wanted to say just how much my son and I enjoyed the children’s sessions today. They were so well organised and refreshing, especially the first workshop this morning, it was brilliant and gave us loads of ideas to take away. The lady delivering it was wonderful and it was perfectly paced for the littlies…” from one of the parents joining in.

June 2016 (and March 2019) – fairandfunky Conference
Two different days at Halifax Minster delivering fairtrade workshops to primary school children centred around the song “An Agent For Change”. You can read all about that here!

fairandfunky wrote their own blog in June 2016 too: Agents of Change – with Fairtrade Halifax – fairandfunky.com

And I got a mention in their 2019 blog too! Be an Agent for Change! Fairtrade Fortnight Conference Review – fairandfunky – fairtrade products

July 4th 2016 – You And Me Attached
On two days in June and July I was one of four artists employed by Wakefield Cathedral to deliver workshops for the Community Cohesion Days for Year 3 students from various Wakefield schools. Cheryl composed the song “You And Me Attached” about making new friends, especially for them and spent her workshop time in the crypt explaining and teaching the song ready for performance in the afternoon sharing session in the quire. You can hear more about these workshops and the song here.

January 20th 2017 – The Worm At The Tyne
The Lambton Worm. We had a musical fight fight fight fight…. and lots of shut up music (Whisht lad haad yer gobs, haad yer mooth, haad yer cake-hole zzzzzipit etc etc) at the Tyne Theatre in Newcastle with children from Gateshead and Gosforth. I was composing this noisy, dramatic stuff while Sandra Kerr did some more tuneful song-writing with movement, then we swapped. This was a University of Newcastle project organised by Jane Nolan, and we had a few of their music undergraduates there too. On a historical note, I might point out that it was a proud moment working on this song in this theatre as this is where the first ever performance of The Lambton Worm was made 150 years ago this year – the Tyne Theatre’s first pantomime.

May-June 2017 – Longframlington Ladies
A one-off project, rather than a one-off workshop, but still… I was approached in December by one of the organisers of the Longframlington Music Festival if I would rehearse and conduct the Sing Out Choir which usually forms for  a couple of months prior to the competitions in June and then performs at the winners’ recital on the last evening of the festival. I did this and the 14 ladies who came along and I tackled some folksongs I’d arranged from New Zealand (including a couple in Maori), a couple of ABBA numbers, and a couple of WW2 songs. We had lots of fun and sang with spirit and tunefulness.

June 2017 – Manu And Sammy
I was hired to deliver musical workshops on the theme of maintaining friendships, with around 200 Year 3 students. These were part of the three Community Cohesion days at Wakefield Cathedral, in which students from several Church of England Primary Schools around the city come to the cathedral with their teachers and teaching assistants for a day of arts-inspired workshops, making new friends at the same time. You can read more about these workshops here!

October 8th 2017 – Miners’ Memorial Service
My newest song for Yew Tree Youth Theatre was performed by them at the Yorkshire Miners’ Memorial Service in Selby Abbey, following a workshop with them a few weeks earlier. The lyrics for the song were taken from Sarah Osborne’s play script and the verses were sung mostly as solos throughout the course of their play which centred on the devastating closure of the Selby Mine.

April 15th 2018 – Leaf Magic
I delivered musical workshops to approximately 60 eager family participants on the general theme of magic in Huddersfield and at Meltham Library. Composing and singing centred around Margaret Mahy’s book “Leaf Magic” with leaf, wind and dance music, much laughter and a rendition of “Yo Ho Yo Ho Ho” as our hero Michael’s gift to the wizard-like “Fish and Chips”. This recording is a truncated compilation of the best bits of the two workshops. I used to use this book a lot when I worked in New Zealand as Composer-In-Schools in 1993-4 so it was really lovely to revisit it.

Some more feedback from the day: “Thank you Cheryl. We loved your engaging, fun workshops. The face of the boy standing on the stage area of The Chestnut Centre, playing the noise of the wind and glowing with pride, is my Pageturners Festival 2018 best memory. Tiffany, Kirklees Libraries.”

June 20th 2018 – Musical Beavers
Today was the second of two workshops with the local Beaver group up at Felton Village Hall. In the first, back in November we did composing, Banana Fanfare 2, singing, dancing. This time they just wanted singing, and just one song so we tackled The Lady In the Tutti Frutti Hat made famous by Carmen Miranda. We worked on accuracy and spirit and performed it 45 minutes later to parents who had come to pick up their Beavers. It was slick and could really do with more work, but fun was had and “singing a song in public” was attained!

July 14th 2018 – Winnowing Winnowing
I went to Gilsland in the very west of Northumberland today to work with the choir there on their end-of-term event. I had composed them a song based on the installation “Fall of Iron” by Imogen Clöet and composer Kit Haigh. The song is about a chaffinch in a threshing barn and uses information and vocabulary I have gobbled up in the last fortnight since visiting the installation myself. The choir composed a beginning and ending made of sounds inspired by the installation and by the song. We then walked along the Hadrian’s Wall path for 20 minutes or so and gave the world premiere at Kit Haigh and Amanda Drago’s Threshing Barn, encircling the sculpture itself. All this in glorious sunshine. The only thing missing really was an actual chaffinch, although there was a visit from a local chicken.

Some feedback from the day:
“Oh the excitement! A new piece composed for the day to celebrate all that was wonderful in Amanda’s threshing barn with the marvellous art installation. You can hear the elation and cheerful joy in the singers as they end their world premiere (complete with windy sounds and chattering chaffinches created by the choir) . Happy times!” (Penny)
“Thank you Cheryl, you offered something really special for the choir, that was unique to the installation too. Fab job.” (Amanda)

Later, I made a video of this song with some photos of the day:

August 2018 – NZCF Adjudicator
One of my more hands-off projects, but still… In May, I was asked to be the Adjudicator for the New Zealand Choral Federation’s (NZCF) Big Sing Composition Competition. This involved making remarks and helpful suggestions to about 15 NZ high school students about the choral entries and picking a winner – all of this in quite a short space of time, but very enjoyable and quite an honour. The winning entry was performed at the finale of the Big Sing competition in August.
I haven’t done anything like this for a while. I felt that these young composers needed encouragement and suggestions not just a result and thereby success or failure, so really went to town on the comments – over the top as usual, but I’m glad I did because there was in turn feedback from them. One lad who receives no tuition at all in composition in his school, but has a yearning to write music, so entered the competition, said he was initially very upset and discouraged by his absence from the winners’ list, but after reading my comments and suggestions a few days later was motivated to continue.
They stream the Big Sing Finale live – it’s 20 or so of NZ’s best Secondary school choirs (selected from regional festivals earlier in the year) singing a couple of mini-recitals and then they receive medals either bronze, silver or gold and sometimes platinum if there’s one that’s outstanding. Each choir has to perform at least one New Zealand work in their recitals and I often do still get pieces played. I had it on in the background one morning in August and up popped my Hodie – quite a treat. You can listen to that here if you like.

May 2011-March 2020 – Hepworth Wakefield
I was employed as a creative practitioner at the gallery delivering composing workshops to schools, families and other visitors, planning activities for these groups, and composing music inspired by the art works on display myself. You can read more about these projects here!

After the lockdowns in 2020-2021, I have not sought out any more opportunities for project work in educational settings and instead have focussed on my work with choirs and several composing commissions. If any more projects crop up, I will add more to this blog, I dare say!